Peter (host):
Neil deGrasse Tyson is a scientist and science communicator. While on the Joe Rogan show, he shared his thoughts about truth, science, and religion.
Neil deGrasse Tyson:
There is something called objective truth. And objective truth is something that is true, whether or not you believe in it. And the methods and tools of science are uniquely conceived, to seek out and establish objective truths. And this I'm referring to the invocation of the scientific method. No one scientific result- the research result is true. Until it is verified by other people's research results, using a different experimental method with different wall current from another country. When your competitor says, " I think you're wrong, let me show how you're wrong." And they would reproduce your experiment and get the same result. When you have generally the same results emerging. That is a newly discovered objective truth about the natural world. And when you have objective truths, they're not later shown to be false - that's an objective truth. Then you have personal truths. These are truths that you hold dearly. Jesus is your Savior. Mohammed is the final prophet on earth. Abraham is your - these are your personal truths, there's a heaven you're going to.
Peter (host):
In our previous episodes, Michael Shermer argued that Christianity is just something that people believe because their friends and family believe it. According to him, the arguments for Christianity, also known as apologetics, aren't convincing to anyone except those who already believe. And Shermer's certainly not alone in making these assertions.
Video Clipa:
I don't believe in God. I believe in science.
Peter (host):
But there are good reasons to reject Shermer's conclusion. And the lives of people like Jordan Monge, Antony Flew, C.S. Lewis, Lee Strobel, and Nabeel Qureshi attest to that.
Lee Strobel:
And so I launched into an investigation using my journalism and my legal background, to try to get to the truth of Christianity.
Nabeel Qureshi:
Our God created the universe, all the stars in the sky. He just thought them into existence that God is willing to die?
Peter (host):
What all these people encountered - what God used to change their lives - is the whole field of Christian apologetics.
Video Clip:
I worked my whole life, I don't apologize.
Peter (host):
No, remember it's not about apologizing. Apologizing or saying you're sorry is an entirely different word from "apologetics".
Peter (host):
Apologetics is about making a defense or giving reasons. It's about using your mind to understand how disciplines like science, history, and philosophy provide a rational basis to believe in Jesus. Apologetics is very useful when someone claims that Christianity is just false. But it's also very useful when someone like Neil deGrasse Tyson claims that it's just a personal subjective truth.
Peter (host):
According to Tyson, there are two types of truths. There are scientific truths that are objective and therefore true for everyone. And there are personal truths, which could also be called subjective truths. For Tyson, religious claims fall into this second category.
Neil deGrasse Tyson:
Then you have personal truths. These are truths that you hold dearly. Jesus is your savior.
Peter (host):
If Tyson is right then all the important facts stated in the Bible. They're all just personal, subjective truths. They're like your favorite food, or your favorite flavor of ice cream.
Video Clip:
Man, I love ice cream. Ice cream, ice cream.
Peter (host);
If you think ice cream tastes better than anything else in the whole world, well, then that's your personal, subjective truth.
Peter (host):
And another subjective truth could be your favorite flavor of ice cream bubble flavor.
Video Clips:
Bubble flavor? It's my favorite. Your favorite? That's my favorite, too!
Peter (host):
According to Tyson, there's no real difference between statements like "bubble ice cream is the best flavor in the whole world", and statements like "God created the universe and Jesus rose from the dead." Those statements, according to Tyson are just personal, subjective truths that you can believe if you want to if they make you feel good, and if you need that sort of thing, but they are objective facts that are true for everybody.
Video Clips:
I'm sorry, but facts are facts. And that's a fact. You better believe it.
Peter (host):
Facts certainly are facts. But let's think about whether Neil deGrasse Tyson is right. Are Christian truth claims as presented in the Bible, just personal truths? When we look at the Bible, do we find it expressing subjective claims akin to our favorite flavor of ice cream? Or does it make objective claims about reality that apply to everyone? Remember that at this point, we're not trying to establish whether the claims are true or not. We're just asking what types of claims are being made.
Neil deGrasse Tyson:
Then you have personal truths. These are truths that you hold dearly.
Peter (host):
Here's the thing. In the Bible, it's clear that Jesus regarded his claims to be objective truths. He did not see himself as simply saying things that just apply to himself or to people who chose to believe them. And Jesus did not present himself as just another teacher or religious leader. No, he said in John 14:6 that he was the Way, the Truth, and the Life. He wasn't just one way amongst many, he wasn't just one truth amongst many truths. He declared that He was the Way, the Truth, and the Life.
Peter (host):
In the end, Jesus died a cruel death on a cross because of what he declared about himself and his message. People do not suffer and die for subjective truth claims. They don't die for their favorite flavor of ice cream.
Video Clip:
Bubble flavor? I would die for that.
Peter (host):
Someone might claim that they die for bubble ice cream, but when they're actually facing life or death, they won't really choose death. No sane, rational person would do that. People suffer and die for the sake of other people, and they die for important objective truths.
Video Clip:
I guess that you're right.
Peter (host):
And it's not just Jesus who's willing to die, His disciples suffered and died, too. In the book of Acts, chapter seven, it records the stoning to death of Stephen, one of Jesus's disciples. Jesus, his brother, James was also killed, and many other disciples were flogged, stoned, beaten, or otherwise made to suffer a great deal. And all of that because of what they were proclaiming about Jesus.
Peter (host):
Historians also tell us that in the first few centuries after Jesus, Christians were willing to suffer and die because of the Savior they follow. Often they died very cruel deaths because they refuse to say that Caesar was Lord. Or in other words, to say that Caesar was some type of God. They knew as an objective fact that only Jesus is Lord. Not only that, but prior to Jesus, there were prophets who are also willing to suffer and die.
Peter (host):
The prophet Daniel was thrown into a den of lions rather than stop praying to God and his friends, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego were thrown into a blazing furnace, rather than bow down and worship a false god.
Video Clips:
What are you talking about? They didn't die.
Peter (host):
You're right. In the case of Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego. They didn't actually die, God rescue them. But they didn't know that God was going to rescue them before they were thrown into a furnace. And so they were still willing to die.
Peter (host):
When Tyson says that Christianity is just a personal truth, he's basically saying that Jesus, His disciples, the early Christians, and the prophets before Jesus didn't know what they were talking about. Essentially, Tyson is either ignoring what the Bible says, or he's just trying to rewrite the Bible.
Video Clip:
That's not exactly honest.
Peter (host):
I agree. It's not honest. Tyson might sound gracious by giving Christians the word "truth", but it's not the way it seems.
Neil deGrasse Tyson:
That's a recipe for disaster.
Interviewer:
-and not a belief?
Neil deGrasse Tyson:
Because the people who hold the belief will tell you that it's the truth. So I don't want to take that usage of the word away from them.
Interviewer:
Okay, so you're giving them a good definition.
Neil deGrasse Tyson:
I'm giving them the word truth, but modifying it to say personal truth. That's correct. I'm not gonna say if they've used it that way for millennia, I'm not gonna- Okay, they feel that is true, and it's true in their bones.
Peter (host):
Tyson presents himself as being gracious and kind to religious people. But he's failing to accept how Christian beliefs are presented in the Bible. Christianity is all about objective claims and those claims are either objectively true or objectively false. There is no other option.
Video Clip:
It's definitely one or the other.
Peter (host):
And that's why apologetics is important. Because if Christianity is objectively true, then it should fit together with the rest of reality. It should make sense in light of history, science, philosophy, and all the academic disciplines that intersect with it.
Peter (host):
There should be good evidence that is apologetics for the objective truth of the Christian worldview. And if the Christian community doesn't provide that, then they're indirectly agreeing with Tyson. But that would mean they're not really following Jesus.
Peter (host):
Christianity is objectively true. Jesus is the Way, the Truth, and the Life and that's why they're good reasons to believe in Him.
Video Clip:
Do you really believe that? Yes, I really do.
Peter (host):
Contrary to what Neil deGrasse Tyson says,
Neil deGrasse Tyson:
Personal truths.
Peter (host):
Christianity makes objective claims about reality. We can see this from the fact that Jesus was willing to die. His disciples, the early Christians, and many prophets were also willing to die. That's not something people do for subjective truths.
Peter (host):
In our next episode, we'll see that not only is Tyson wrong about faith in Jesus, he's also wrong but other religions of the world as well. And that's what we'll look at in our next episode.
Female Narrator:
You're listening to LIT by Worldview Summit with Peter Kupisz.